If you have never read "Atlas Shrugged", I would highly recommend it. Even though it was written over 50 years ago, it is high prophetic concerning todays America. So much so that it's downright creepy.
Beware the man who has one gun, he probably knows how to use it.
I'm hopping back to this because the short answer above (given during class...hehe) doesn't do it justice, and ATF has a perfectly valid point. My opinions aren't any more right or wrong than any other without some support or logic, eh? These are the real numbers, as best I can pull while using the school equipment (only one monitor and no utilities...have mercy..heh)
Local Law Enforcement Across the United States: 593,000 (2008 DOJ Numbers)
Approx. Total Federal Law Enforcement: 120,000-140,000 (The range comes from disparity of source data / 2008 DOJ Report - 2006 GAO Report
Total US Military in Active Service Today: Approx 1.4 Million (Global Firepower) It MUST be noted...that isn't 1.4 million men with M-16 service rifles and a battle pack to deploy with. That includes secretaries, drivers, food service people. cargo pilots, airframe maintenance people and EVERYONE who is a member of the US military in any active service capacity.
So, worst case scenario, and to enlist every warm body in all three of the above categories, we'd have just over 2 million who at least worked in some proximity to firearms and use of force before being thrown into the maw of an angry American citizenry needing control.
An article looking at military ratio for service in modern times found this, to put a bit more perspective on that military number in what they call the "Tooth to Tail" ratio:
A recent McKinsey study found that the "tooth to tail" ratio in the active duty U.S. military was roughly one to three in 2008: for every service member in a combat or combat-support position, there were more than three service members in non-combat-related positions. A 2010 Defense Business Board study found that 40 percent of active duty military personnel had never even been deployed — and that’s during a decade in which the United States was at war in both Iraq and Afghanistan.
As another more exhaustive report of this takes a look, they state in the opening introduction that ratios of 13 or 14 troops per thousand residents, with at least 4 of those dedicated to just law enforcement (keeping the routine crime, always happening anyway, under control) is a minimum for planning with counter-insurgency operations....which any attempt to lock down the US would quickly become. (The Other End of the Spear) Note: That is a BIG PDF report
So, bottom line..in my opinion of course...is that they could try, and may give it a go at some point. They may succeed in the major cities and immediate suburbs, for awhile ..or maybe not. Depends on what part of the nation we're talking about I'd think (I pity the ones assigned to subdue Boise, or Missoula....and a return flight isn't likely necessary for them). Outside the concentrations of population though? Get into the rural areas and countryside that form 90% of our nation?
Well... We'll get to play Cowboys and Indians again, just like when we were kids ..only the Calvary actually 'plays' the Indians this time, and no one can call 'time out' when they lose that little fight. (When you think about it? The numbers almost make the comparison to the Indian Wars an apt one, too.....reversed this time)
Wrabbit, you need to stretch your imagination a little more! L_L
Terrorists taint the water supply...earthquake destroys the west coast...the power grid goes down...an 'unknown' deadly virus begins to spread. People are ordered to stay in place;cities are locked down; LEO and military ordered to shoot to kill any who try to leave. I don't think it would take too many troops to get the masses to comply- especially if their kids were being given food and water.
The virus-which gov workers would have been vaccinated against (unknowingly) would quickly eliminate a lot of dross.
The few thousand who thought the could go off-grid could be easily found with FLIR and taken care of.
Think all those UFO's with cloaking technology are from another planet? What if they're OURS! Those poor off-gridders wouldn't know what hit them! roflmao
You're much smarter than I, Wrabbit-put your tinfoil hat on and give us some scenarios where our 'benefactors' could blindside us!
Now....to give the other side of that? If I was in charge of scenario planning at DHS, I can tell you I have a plan that would have control over and effectively subdue the American population, by force, within 30 days. By the end of it, those with the means to fight...would lack the open field and supportive background to hide in, while doing it.
How??? Easy, but rather complex to pull off ....still? That I can think of this, means people paid to do it for a living have far better variants of this idea mapped out.
---- Prerequisites
Americans thrive and define themselves, in many ways, by two things. Their sense of belonging within the larger group (community, state, nation and so on) and the ability or perceieved ability to remain informed and know what is happening at the mere desire to learn.
Those both have to go, like a dinosaur, right in the opening moments......and you'll have over 1/2 the coming effort finished, before it even begins... ---- How it would start
How do you cut off over 300 million people, and make them ignorant, scared and eager to accept news from almost any source coming from the outside? You remove every other alternative an average person has or has really ever known in the modern world.
#1. Electromagmetic Pulse waves by orbital detonations would be required for two reasons. First, you need the people to believe a calamity is upon them, others are faring MUCH MUCH WORSE, and so, each person believes they are lucky as it is ...and but for the grace of God go I. This is achieved by the flash and sky lightening effects of Near Earth nuclear detonation. No one actually dies...but anyone on the peripheral of view can easily assume that they are seeing the lighted edge of a ground ...not low orbit burst. Second .... Radio, Internet and Television outside official sources MUST CEASE. If people feel informed (REAL OR NOT) they will have some mental handle to grab in resistance. If they are ignorant and KNOW that, while flashes in the sky suggest a World War for real? Fear and compliance by lack of alternative is what I'd call likely.
#2. Give a day or two or chaos at the street level, and NO communications beyond line of sight and the carry of a voice ...then move the troops in as saviors and protectors, nothing more...at first. Given the existing situation? Anything rolling with food, water and news will be welcomed like Old Home Week.
#3. INSURE your troops are only slightly more informed than the citizens. After all, the troops ARE the citizens in our system, and "us vs. them" has REAL limits. No risk can be taken for a trooper with a conscience. Also, if troops are equally fearful and confused, the conveyance of that to the citizens will be complete and geniune. People tend to follow the emotional lead of the authority they look toward. If authority is nervous? People are outright scared.
---- How it would progress
#4. During this first week, encouragement of the criminal element is required and essential. Failing this? 5-7 days is a range to expect average people to have seen shock wear off and begin reassessing their position, while slowing down enough to ask questions while demanding answers. Bad Bad thing..and one week hasn't been long enough yet. So....the criminal element building for the first week should be at a fever pitch without any effort to curb it thus far ....and the citizens, in the isolated realities across the nation, will see the need and appreciate the help with 'handling those nasty criminals'.
#5. I'd guess that carries across weeks 2 and 3. By the end of week 3, and the measures required in crisis to suppress crime by force? Citizens will have seen enough violence in the street from that effort, to look at the armed Hummer on the corner ..and checkpoint on Main Street as something comforting..not scary ...while..who knows what is happening 'out there' ..or how many in the nation even survived? (ALL of them, of course...but each isolated area never knows this, by design)
---- The End
#6. Week 4 should close with the ability to slowly restore communications as possible, with the new reality of a 'war-time' America, and where the concerns or "petty" worries we'd recall from a month ago seem irrelevant, being the new norm.
-
We've spent over 6 years being conditioned to go numb at the onslaught of non-stop crisis ...and its worked. That will serve them well in a scenario like the above. It has trained people to go cold, as needed, or at least, go numb as required ..to do what it takes to make it. Small stuff..before now..but the core lesson by years of this, has been absorbed. The above would simply give the potential a real scenario to become reality with.
Hopefully TPTB aren't ruthless ENOUGH to go as far as the above 1 month plan would require......but I do believe it would work in MOST areas of the nation. Those it didn't?? Well, if they already went that far? Who would say every burst NEEDS to be off the ground? In fact, a couple rats above glass blast zones might reinforce the whole thing following the 4th week.
Wrabbit, you need to stretch your imagination a little more! L_L
You're much smarter than I, Wrabbit-put your tinfoil hat on and give us some scenarios where our 'benefactors' could blindside us!
Actually, my last post here was being written while you wrote that. :)
It took me about the hour break I have between classes...but the above scenario is one I've had in the back of my mind to key on..if I ever saw the hint of it starting...as one of the only 'near 100% sure' approaches to getting the job against us done.
Doug,@wrabbit2000,Nugget,Mystic Wanderer,wow there we go Bravo Bravo now we're using more than 13% of our Brains thank you guys for no closing discussion opportunity this is great.
I think pretty much every one here actually enjoys these types of discussion, even if we disagree at times or how something would/could be done. I know I love it!
One thing Wrabbit left out (I think) is that there are plenty more Vets out there than there are Active, Reservist, or National Guard on the current rolls. Remember those people? The ones that DHS has deemed to be a possible threat? They would be a great organizing force in cities, isolated towns and rural areas and would be able to see through any BS the clueless troops may say. Hell, they may even end up comprosing said troops to support them, rather than a Gov't Martial law.
In Wrabbit's scenario, I see a Civil war breaking out in no time. At least within six months as individuals try to seize local power and then expand upon it.
Beware the man who has one gun, he probably knows how to use it.
Nugget,tighten more like I'm turning blue due to blood circulation loss Jade Helm could be a drill also to see how fast they can get their precious elite underground it all makes sense...!!!
Last Edit: Apr 20, 2015 13:54:20 GMT -6 by atf1886
How do you cut off over 300 million people, and make them ignorant, scared and eager to accept news from almost any source coming from the outside? You remove every other alternative an average person has or has really ever known in the modern world.
#1. Electromagmetic Pulse waves by orbital detonations would be required for two reasons. First, you need the people to believe a calamity is upon them, others are faring MUCH MUCH WORSE, and so, each person believes they are lucky as it is ...and but for the grace of God go I. This is achieved by the flash and sky lightening effects of Near Earth nuclear detonation. No one actually dies...but anyone on the peripheral of view can easily assume that they are seeing the lighted edge of a ground ...not low orbit burst. Second .... Radio, Internet and Television outside official sources MUST CEASE. If people feel informed (REAL OR NOT) they will have some mental handle to grab in resistance. If they are ignorant and KNOW that, while flashes in the sky suggest a World War for real? Fear and compliance by lack of alternative is what I'd call likely.
#2. Give a day or two or chaos at the street level, and NO communications beyond line of sight and the carry of a voice ...then move the troops in as saviors and protectors, nothing more...at first. Given the existing situation? Anything rolling with food, water and news will be welcomed like Old Home Week.
#3. INSURE your troops are only slightly more informed than the citizens. After all, the troops ARE the citizens in our system, and "us vs. them" has REAL limits. No risk can be taken for a trooper with a conscience. Also, if troops are equally fearful and confused, the conveyance of that to the citizens will be complete and geniune. People tend to follow the emotional lead of the authority they look toward. If authority is nervous? People are outright scared.
Hopefully TPTB aren't ruthless ENOUGH to go as far as the above 1 month plan would require......but I do believe it would work in MOST areas of the nation. Those it didn't?? Well, if they already went that far? Who would say every burst NEEDS to be off the ground? In fact, a couple rats above glass blast zones might reinforce the whole thing following the 4th week.
@wrabbit, Or, could it be something more along these lines to usher in the One World Government?
If they really built that extensive underground network, as I also think is quite possible (likely, in fact, for at least some of it) then I think they are feeling really nervous and a bit foolish by now.
Billions....and really, it's billions...of gallons of highly toxic water sits not far below the level of where all that should...and really...needs to be, if it would work at all. All those waste injection wells, never supposed to come above the impermeable layer they think they shoot it below (See info on Kola Borehole for direct observation showing a whole layer thought to be in the crust ..doesn't even exist), occasionally DO .... and occasionally may very well just mean where man has been to detect it where it shouldn't be.
..and I watch the quake readings, daily. I have for a long time now. Its usually entertaining in a 'nothing much happening but ...can I figure by numbers alone, where this or that one happened?' kind of way. It has been getting more active all over the United States though, and in the most unlikely of places ...to be cracking rock far far below us. Kilometers below ...through so called impermeable layers.
So what does a DUMB look like, when a water table from hell (almost a literal thing here) starts coming up like flooding in a basement? (I shouldn't laugh at the image..but they DO deserve it, one must agree?)
Whoa! One of those tunnels goes right under my hometown!!!
Well, all this is coming together now. There have been many threads about the elites building underground tunnels with lavish "presidential suites" to live in when the shit hits the fan. I've wondered if the metallic noise people have been hearing around the globe isn't "them" down there connecting their metal air vents, or something. This could be why no explanation for the sound has been made public.
This is getting scarier by the minute! But, now that we have some foreknowledge about what's going on, (if it does happen) we should be able to know how to handle it appropriately, better prepared... at the very least, knowledge (if our communication is cut from the world).
But, wouldn't a person be able to hide inside caves in the mountains, or build an underground space to hide? You could make clothes covered in animal hair covered with leaves if you have to venture out for any amount of time. There has to be something to prevent the FLIR from being able to see a person. I'm going to have to look into this further. 7/39
Mystic Wanderer, Yea, FLIR is pretty easy to hide from, though in order to be really successful at it you must remain in place. It's harder to shield yourself on the move.
Plenty of other heat sources as well. The best FLIR the military has is not that great at picking up human heat though it will pick up vehicles and homes real quick like. In the winter, it's another story. But residual heat does mess with it. Terrain also plays an important role. Heavy vegetation can provide cover as well.
Beware the man who has one gun, he probably knows how to use it.